New Rigid Pilot

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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Jase » Wed Oct 16, 2013 12:38 pm

After landing on the tail, I did in fact crack the keel, Doh! Just a small crack in the aluminium part around the large hole where the flap retraction bungee comes out. Oh well!

Rob,
I also have a VQ, and that little crack around the flap exit has happened on mine too. although the ally part of the keel is only about 3' long, it's a £360 part !!!! or it was to me.
As for landing, the only way I'm able to pull off a light wind landing is to use full flaps and flare hard. I have a tenax harness, so getting high up the uprights is really difficult. This is about as high as I can get them, but it does seem to produce just about the right amount of flare for me.
landing VQ.jpg
Landing VQ
landing VQ.jpg (39.94 KiB) Viewed 4049 times

Any attempts I've made to run off a landing just end is disaster. FYI if you do "nose in" it doesn't stop there. the nose is so short a distance from the front of the uprights that by the time you have hit the nose, the glider is almost vertical, and hence - over you go. Extremely embarrassing !
I guess the body position for running off a landing is completely different, as you need to have your legs underneath you to be able to run.

Good luck. I've had mine for 5 yrs and still absolutely love it!
Jason Smith
Atos VQ
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Johnnybravo » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:14 am

JohnB

A-I-R Atos VR/WW Sport 2 (155)/BMW R1150R.
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby timking » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:58 am

the problem with a big flare and and stopping 2 feet off the ground (particularly for the shorter pilot ) is that the glider impacts the ground through the tail and keel. the harder the ground and the bigger the flair the worse this is for the glider.
2 years ago in Laragne i witnessed a German pilot do exactly this.....he was so proud to have done a no step landing.... so being a kindly type of bloke having sat around drinking beer for a couple of hours i showed him the weak spot on the keel where the strings exit and the fracture that was making good progress around the ali tube ......and then beat a swift retreat
If you buy a second hand VR check the keel for signs of fracture around the weak points - slots where the wires and cords exit the keel - about £600 to replace keel- more expensive to replace after failure mid air.
Try to land on feet ( yes a fine thing for me to say)
Tim King
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Johnnybravo » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:51 pm

Tim,
Yes I agree, and not just VR's! Banging the control frame down on the ground causes the buckle and crack (same hole for all the glider models).
I have a 'home made' strengthened keel (similar keel to Phil T's VR, which is for sale) stored ready for the 'next time'. But ofcourse if you strengthen one area, the 'bang in' will find the next weak spot. Maybe weakening the upright (downtube) weaklinks may help.
Here is the previous 'thread' on this forum:-
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2735&p=10249#p10249
JohnB

A-I-R Atos VR/WW Sport 2 (155)/BMW R1150R.
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby nev » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:55 pm

A good point from Tim.

Just so clarity isn't lost on a point that I've been trying to make, there are broadly 3 types of landing:

(1) Controlled
(2) Losing control, so cop-out of wild flare and risk keel damage
(3) Losing control, so cop-out of frontal/wheeled landing and higher risk of bodily damage.

I'm a strong advocate of (2) instead of (3), and is the reason I choose not to use wheels (its not a fashion/image/drag thing). The aggrevation they provide during takeoff IMHO is greater than the perceived benefit on landing, as I never expect to have to use them as in rare circumstances of not achieving (1) I will opt for (2).

Just an opinion and food for thought............
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Schwabby » Mon Mar 10, 2014 8:13 am

Morning all!

After spending over an hour rigging on Beer Head yesterday (still unfamiliar with the sequence), I am wondering, still, what the purpose of the black plastic/elastic loop on the nose is for. It kind of gets tangled around the tensioning cord and pulley assembly, (which I'm sure I have routed incorrectly!).

Any thoughts? Just remove it? It seems to do very little and is very weak and flimsy...
Yay! It's flyable!
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby nev » Mon Mar 10, 2014 10:18 am

what the purpose of the black plastic/elastic loop


On the VR, you thread it through the rope on the end of the tip wand (after the L/E extensions have been inserted into the D-Box.

It prevents the L/E extensions moving toward the tip-end of the D-box - if it does, you need to stand them upright and shake until they reappear :).

Defo keep it clear of the pulley for obvious reasons - easily done by placing into D-box, then inserting the glider bag next......
Nev
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Schwabby » Mon Mar 10, 2014 10:59 am

Haha! I see!! That's why 3 of us had to shake the tubes out!!

Thanks!! Rob.
Yay! It's flyable!
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Martin » Mon Mar 10, 2014 3:35 pm

You can see Felix lace up the nose pulley's in the following Video (5:20 mark)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Npop0S7_Hro

I think... the loop is intend to prevent the lacing cord from becoming tangled with the nose catch during the loose phase (dropping over/into the nose catch). You will also see where the cord climbs back from the bottom (on the left leading edge) across the catch (going to an upper right leading edge pulley) its pretty easy to cluster mess that section. After a while you get to experience all of the various mistakes and learn to avoid them.

Also, after a bit, you will get a feel for how much tension is "right" for a normal rig and how much is "wrong". "Wrong".... means "more then what is needed" and should inspire a re-check of of the pulley cord routing and a check of the tip sections (properly seated) and tip wands (same).... forcing your way might just rip your sail or break some lovely carbon.

If your getting frustrated..... repeat after me..... "I love my glider.... I love my glider...." ;-)

Martin
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby Schwabby » Mon Mar 10, 2014 6:34 pm

Ah! Illuminating! I wish I had seen that video before my last 2 rigging attempts. It has all become clear now.

Day off tomorrow, better get out to Pandy!

I love my glider, I love my glider!

Many thanks for the top tips.

Rob.
Yay! It's flyable!
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Re: New Rigid Pilot

Postby nev » Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:21 pm

Ah-ha, another use of the cord (for the quick-rig variants).
The cord on my early production VR was before Felix had even dreamed about lacing (that sounds wrong!)

BTW - caught sight of this earlier from the RW forum (Yahoogroups)

Yesterday in Florida I was flying my Phantom at or around 3900agl. In mild lift turning left , I heard a noise and immediately checked cables and Pitt pins. Glider kept turning left despite efforts to level wings out. Turn progressed to a vertical spin. Tried various things to control it to no avail . Put flaps on full and tried centering myself in control frame. Kept an eye on altitude and decided at 2000agl was my bail out point. Pulled chute out and at 1900agl tossed it. Glider which was vertical settled under me and speed and noise decreased. I was still descending fast , didn't realize how fast until I was about. 300', glider hit ground first and must of rotated as I found myself under the broken control frame. Scratched but not broken, can't say the same for my wing . I believe an Aerleron cable out by the tip broke. I'll take the sail off in a few days and inspect cables more. John Pettinato
Nev
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